Kara Swisher

Recent Posts by Kara Swisher

Adobe CTO Kevin Lynch Talks About Apple Insults, Flash's Future and More!

For a man scorned, Adobe CTO Kevin Lynch looked awfully calm on my visit to the software company’s San Francisco HQ yesterday.

He could, I suppose, be hopping mad.

To add insult to injury–from an inside-baseball tech point of view, at least–after Apple (AAPL) introduced the iPad tablet in January without Flash Player technology, which Apple also kept out of the iPod and iPhone, word immediately floated up that CEO Steve Jobs had dissed Adobe as “lazy” at an employee meeting.

Also, added Jobs, Adobe (ADBE) had let Flash become a buggy security nightmare and resource hairball.

Lynch was only a tiny bit less cutting in his blog reaction to the lack of Flash in the iPad at its launch: “Some have been surprised at the lack of inclusion of Flash Player on a recent magical device.”

Of course, he was not surprised at all, which is why Adobe was very busy lately announcing a wide range of initiatives.

They included yesterday’s rollout at the Mobile World Congress in Spain of a version of Adobe’s AIR software for a wide range of smartphones, as well as showing off Flash 10.1 on Google’s Android devices.

Such effusive touting is now Lynch’s most important job as the head techie in charge of Flash. The ubiquitous video technology is under siege not only from Apple, but also from many others, including Google (GOOG), all of which are aiming to make the Web work someday without the need for Flash in an HTML5 universe.

Still, Adobe is forging ahead with Google and other makers of smartphone platforms, except for Apple, to make Flash work better–as well as with a range of publishers to become the technology used in e-reader products.

But rather than BoomTown explaining it all for you, here is Lynch himself talking about the flashpoints over Flash, including fixing Adobe’s well-documented security issues with malware, his feelings about what Jobs said and efforts to keep Flash innovative.

I will also have a demo by Lynch up later, but here is the video of his interview first:


comments so far. Add yours.

  • Anonymous

    Kevin doesn’t mention that Flash Authoring tools are reall an abstraction layer with a timeline interface and visual tools, that flash is a program and runtime script generator. This means the CS5 authoring engines can output whatever Adobe wants to output. That compact file goes to AIR, Builder, Flex, Flash plugin and Apple “native” runtime engines that do everything they need, not just animate, but render video and interaction with touch and mouse and fetch-send data of all types, in real time at controlled screen frame-rates.
    to say that HTML5 with whatever SVG extensions can compete with that ( even jQuery and canvas javascript stuff ) is laughable… but unless you are one of those people that creates this stuff, you wont know it.

  • Anonymous

    Actually, Flash sucks. I’d like to thank Apple for making it harder for everyone to use Flash, now that we have HTML 5 and canvas. Hopefully, that will drive more web “developers” (read: “designers that should stay the hell away from programming”) away from the Flash crap.

  • Anonymous

    techtrader10 is an aapl short, is still very bitter because he got burned recently and had to foreclose on his home. Since he is unemployed, he spends most of his time in the local library using free internet posting his anti-AAPL garbage. Check him out here http://seekingalpha.com/user/362456/comments

  • techtrader10

    It sounds like there is a problem with Apple's OS that doesn't allow it to use Adobe's Flash. Since the iPad is using the iPhone OS, it's likely the reason Flash isn't on the iPad is the OS can't handle it.

  • davidlyons179

    Kara, this is an extremely important issue for all users of PC and Mac (i.e. evolution towards HTML5 standard) and thank you for posting your interview with Kevin Lynch. It seems, however, that Kevin took the “high ground” and you preferred the “low ground” by moving things to what Apple or Steve Jobs said about Flash. On topics as important as this for all of us, my recommendation would be for you to share the “high ground”

  • dpertell

    What the heck was that? Just more spin! Kara you should have asked Kevin this question, “If you and Steve Jobs switch rolls, would you let a third party software company put their close and private A/V product on the iPhone/iTouch/iPad, all the R&D that you did that took 2 years or more, come in and control those units?”

    Adobe could also high-jack it, thinking they are so important to the units because they run the A/V experience. Adobe could hold out the software later because they own/control Flash by wanting Apple to pay a percent of the money that those units bring in. Who is the HELL would do that?

    Why is do people think that Flash is so indispensable? For those who don't remember, there was Windows Media, Quicktime and Real Media doing the A/V work before Flash video came on the scene. Flash replace them because it was, make long story short, cheaper. You know whats cheaper, OPEN and better that Flash? HTML5…that right, it free!

    Keep this in mind, Steve Jobs does. 13th paragraph, start reading here “But a 1998 meeting in…” http://money.cnn.com/magazines.....ne_…

  • http://www.newzwag.com jondillon

    “Still, except for Apple, Adobe is nonetheless forging ahead with Google and other makers of smartphone platforms on making Flash work well on them”

    I'm surprised you didn't mention that Flash also won't be running on the new Windows 7 Phone when its released later this year

  • nickkwiatkowski

    @dpertell:

    I don't think Flash became a big player in the video space because they were cheap. They are no less expensive than Windows Media.

    The reason why Flash became popular is because developers could target the Flash Player and be assured that the content would play. No need for the end user to download this plugin, or that software, download the file, save it, launch it, etc. It just worked. And the end user didn't have to worry about the Microsoft vs. Apple spat by not having the correct codecs or software, etc. on their machine.

    Adobe is still one of the few players that developers can rely on to be available across the board. As the Mac vs. PC wars continue to heat up, without a lot of wrangling, people still can watch media created on the other side. In the browser space, it is the same thing. You can't watch media created for Chrome on a Firefox browser — and you can't watch any of it on IE.

  • http://ARMdevices.net/ Charbax

    Check my video interview with Adobe Flash 10.1 product manager Richard Galvan at http://armdevices.net/2010/02/.....ress-2010/

    Please also check all my other HD quality videos from Mobile World Congress at my http://armdevices.net anyone is welcome to embed any of my videos if I get a link thanks.

  • nicolasitunes

    Adobe IS lazy, as a longtime Mac user on the latest machine and OS Apple has, I always get crashes from Flash, it's ridiculous. And beyond crashes, the amount of resources that flash takes up is just insane. I have recently switched to HTML5 on youtube and vimeo and even in beta they work much better. I do believe Apple sends them reports of bugs in Flash (apparently just shy of 500) because everytime Flash crashes my Mac it automatically sends a report to Apple, and believe me it has happened numerous numerous times in the last few years. Simply unacceptable.

  • techtrader10

    Nicolasitunes, you just confirmed my suspicions. The reason Adobe Flash is not used on the iPhone and won't be used on the iPad, is it takes too much in the way of resources. Since the iPad will be using the iPhone OS, it just doesn't have enough power to run Flash.

  • http://www.facebook.com/sbiehle Sean Biehle

    Adobe is lazy. Every new release of their software is more bloated than the previous, often without adding any notable functionality. If you have ever used any of their products in Windows or OSX, you would know what a resource hog they are.

    This is not an Apple vs Adobe thing, it's an Adobe vs HTML5 thing. Lynch himself says that 75 percent of video on the Web currently is shown in a Flash. HTML video containers are a bigger threat to Flash than Apple will ever be.

  • fud

    I enjoyed the interview, Lynch seems really sincere on improving Flash. However, I think there are 2 issues here.

    Flash has been a cpu hog, especially on any older Mac, and I think this is where the “lazy” comment is accurate. On older Mac's used by family members, I now just turn OFF Flash so it doesn't max out the cpu and turn an otherwise very useable computer into a slug. I personally like to browse with lots of windows open, and turning Flash OFF until it's needed really improves the experience, less flickering obnoxious ads, and faster browsing.

    The 2nd frustration with Flash, is visiting the website of a restaurant, or other business, with Flash OFF, and seeing a totally blank screen, no address, no phone number, not even the most basic information about the business. Totally amazes me that a business would buy off on this. Another example of “lazy” web design. The animation and glitz is more important than real information. Plus it allows the web designer to avoid testing for the old, non-standard IE6 in WinXP that's holding the web back. Flash has a place, but it's out of control. “If the only tool you have is a hammer, you tend to see every problem as a nail.” The success of the iPhone, iPad, and HTML5 will hopefully lessen the grip of Flash on the web.

  • bobab

    techtrader10 is an AAPL short, is still very bitter because he got burned recently and had to foreclose on his home. Since he is unemployed, he spends most of his time in the local library using free internet posting his anti-AAPL garbage. Check him out here http://seekingalpha.com/user/362456/comments

  • onemonkeysuncle

    Oh. My. God. Did he like RILLY RILLY SAY THAT?!?1!!? That is SO. AWSUM!

    Please. Spare us the exclamation marks and the tween gushing next time. This is embarrassing.

  • Anonymous

    @techtrader10,

    Flash is a resource hog on full scale mac OS X. They have been reticent about fixing the hundreds of bugs they have on that OS. And they take way to much CPU for playing videos. That means that it would lower the battery life of the iPhone. It is not that the phone or the OS doesn’t have enough power, the iPhone is running the same processor as other phones. It is that Adobe has been lazy about tuning Flash and fixing bugs for OS X. Given that track record, why should Apple take a poorly written unoptimized program and put it on their platform?

  • videotapingfordummies

    Kara, first of all you need to learn how to use a camcorder, because your videos are unwatchable. Do you get that close on purpose? Is it a commercial for Proactive?!?
    Second, open YouTube on your desktop computer and check the CPU usage. Do you see the spike? Can you hear the fans getting louder and louder? Ok, now unless Flash becomes a lighter process it just won't work on an iPhone.

  • Anonymous

    Unlike Flash, HTML5 has no security model to support people who make their living off of video content. This is a MASSIVE gap! TV providers and movie studios need to be able to do business. Until this is addressed there’s no point in even discussing HTML5.

  • erja

    It sounds like you do not know very much.

  • tom_m

    adobe is NOT lazy. just because it runs poorly on os x while it runs well on other platforms does not mean it’s adobe’s fault. wtf? can apple do no wrong? is OS X the BEST thing in the world and the fastest running operating system? check your heads. apple does NOT set the benchmark for what is cutting edge and does not get to decide what isn’t good and what is. it’s just these sick and twisted loyalty that people have. and it exists within all circles, windows users as well. die hard microsoft users. diehard linux users. just give it up. be flexible. otherwise you’re gonna bang your head on your keyboard when things don’t go your way and walk around with a stick up your rear end sitting in starbucks on your non-functioning computer thinking you’re hot poo. sucks for you that you can’t run flash well. i can. next time make a better purchasing decision if you want that functionality.

  • Anonymous

    what the hell are you talking about nick? “No need for the end user to download…..” That is 100% what Flash 7, 8, 9, 10, and 10.1 are about. Use facts friend, please

  • http://www.facebook.com/ziyad.dadabhoy Ziyad Dadabhoy

    Flash may be a slight resource hog but Apple has also made OSX unfriendly with Flash. It seems like OSX is the one that always has problems.

  • nicolasitunes

    i edit hd movies in 4k, 45 megapixel pictures with the ease and speed of editing a text file. but when i run a youtube video, or vimeo or any flash website, it resource hogs the hell out of it. just scroll up and see what the adobe cto says: “flash for mac improvements are coming”. flash is the problem, that's why windows mobile 7, and most mobile devices don't include it, bloated, spaghetti built software.

  • Anonymous

    Apple is sneaky. – Here’s my crazy theory.

    If iphones could play flash then suddenly there would be lots of flash developers out there that would be able to make cool flash gadgets and applications for iphones WITHOUT going through Apple’s exclusive channel. Apple are making huge amount of money from their strong-hold over applications for iphones etc. Even to just join the iphone developer standard program costs $99 (USD), not to mention to gains they take from every application sold.

    I think this is the real reason why we haven’t seen Flash on iphones…. yet.

    Long live Flash.

  • Anonymous

    http://www.200Linx.com – The Ultimate iPad Home page
    Apple’s new iPad is designed to make navigating the web easier and intuitive.
    200Linx was designed to be the ultimate, most convenient iPad home page.
    It’s brings you everything that’s good on the Internet in one click, on one place.
    iPad is the best way to experience the web.
    200Linx is the best way to experience iPad.

  • jescott63

    I don't think anyone has mentioned that the reason Flash does so poorly on the Mac OS X is possible just that it's Unix and maybe its just a Red Headed step child to work with. Considering how Flash works fine with Linux which is open source. Maybe its just a Apple problem. Why do people stick up for Apple? They are the one's with the closed ecosystem. If Adobe can make Flash work on everything else why would you blame them?

  • jlynpers

    Last I checked, Flash requires a plug-in. Flash works extremely well on Windows but on my other machines (OS X and Linux) it does not. I have disabled it and do not miss it one bit.

  • NHoutdoorphotographer

    Flash is a joke and has been since when Macromedia owned it. Forget about the issues with Flash and Apple, Flash is a CPU and Resource hog on any Windows PC! Have you ever noticed the cooling fans on your laptop spinning up and kicking into high gear whenever you're on a website that has something displayed using Flash??

  • http://mindtaker.blogspot.com/ drunken_economist

    Actually, this IS an Apple v. Adobe thing. Adobe's CEO attempted to horn his way into the iPhoneOS with statements like 'Apple will have no choice but to enable Flash in 2010': http://is.gd/8Huk8 and all that.

    There are worthy competitors and 'beneath contempt' ones. And it's obvious what Steve thinks because this is the second time, this time with the WSJ that Jobs 'allegedly' threw the 'L' word on Adobe.

    Adobe could do a number of things: One is to serve Flash in a way that iPhones can render like MSFT is doing with Silverlight-IIS-Server. Another is to go back to the old Adobe that we all knew from 5 years ago. Shut up about politics, PRODUCE (as in 'show us, not just talk'), and then rake in the cash.

    Lynch's interview was actually a first encouraging step back to the old Adobe. If anything we need ADBE to go back to being a 'worthy competitor' to Apple the same way they were when they were competing against MACR. Remember those days.. they seem so far away…

  • 1sttimer

    Bobab,
    Regardless of Techtraders comments you are burying yourself with some really bad karma by taking enjoyment of anybody who got burned and has had their life flipped upside down. There are a lot of people this is happening to. I hope the Karma doesn't get you.

    P.S. I have no idea who you are or who Techtrader is, just trying to help you socially. Seriously.

  • Anonymous

    thanks

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